Ply for Albacore hull repair

[Ed]

Oh....do try and re-size them...or send to me and I will do it for you if you want.

Would love to see that.

I have not always done so well with predicting colour change in woods. It seems to me that some woods like Agba (in my experience) have faded over a couple of years, but certainly some good mahoganies do get darker over 6 months, before gradually fading (and going grey) over the years. But I am very jealous of someone who can accurately predict a good match in a year or two's time.

On the other hand, I have been amazed by how sometimes, without planning, a patch that looks 'pretty good' at first can in a few months blend into the surrounding wood so it practically disappears in a couple of years.

eib

[Graham L]

Ed

The website says I can only have 125kB, and Idon't know how to take them down that small. If there is a way I canget them to you, you can play with them and then perhaps get them onto the forum.

Regards

Graham

[Graham L]

Just coming back regarding photos of the Albacore repair. I have been unable to upload them on this website, but have put them on photobucket on this link:

http://s1054.photobucket.com/albums/s483/Woodman617/

The order of pictures shows:
a) the boat after being revarnished (3 coats UCP, 4 coats Goldspar) whilst fitting new slot gaskets
b) aft edge of the foredeck laminates and mast gate which had to be repaired with epoxy after the original cascamite glue turned to powder (I also backed the laminates with thin ply for extra strength)
c) the boat as it came back from Derek Jolly after the repair with a new piece of Agba. You can appreciate that at this stage I was trusting Derek when he said the wood wood fade!
d) the boat racing on the Trent at Notts SC about 18 months later. You can see that the repair is now blending very well
e) the boat in April this year, 3 years after the repair. It is now practically invisible to the casual glance.

In summary, talk to your wood supplier and by careful selection you should get a good match by letting the wood 'do it's thing' and fade naturally. In my case the boat came back at the start of winter, so I left it in the garage with the covers off the repaired area and let the light get to it over the next few months before the start of the season.

Hope this helps

Graham L
Firefly 2380
Albacore 5893 (Knight & Pink 1976)
Flying Fifteen 617 (Chippendale 1963)

[lindenlea]

Hello, I'm currently restoring a Firefly, F1725, and have found a really good colour match of 2mm veneer from Robbins Bristol. It blends perfectly with the golden yellow of the rubbed down surface next to it. I bought a goodly amount of it at a reasonable cost of around £32. So far I've used less than half though I have a second, F2410,even more rotten Firefly awaiting attention!

The boat I am currently working on has been repaired before and the repair veneer is so dark as for me to think a different species has been applied though reading your messages, perhaps not. I have had these sheets for a couple of years and like I said, the colour is spot on.

I have cut and positioned sections ready for glueing but have am unsure of what adhesive and filler to choose. Can anyone advise me as there will certainly be at least small voids to be filled due to scars on the middle layer and my less than perfect scarf work.

Though I joined some years ago, I have been away from this site for some time due to the entirely worthy distraction of a grandchild.
However, at last I am now getting on with my boat in a garage in Corfe Castle.

Graham Wetten.

[kfz]

Hello, I'm currently restoring a Firefly, F1725, and have found a really good colour match of 2mm veneer from Robbins Bristol. It blends perfectly with the golden yellow of the rubbed down surface next to it. I bought a goodly amount of it at a reasonable cost of around £32. So far I've used less than half though I have a second, F2410,even more rotten Firefly awaiting attention!

The boat I am currently working on has been repaired before and the repair veneer is so dark as for me to think a different species has been applied though reading your messages, perhaps not. I have had these sheets for a couple of years and like I said, the colour is spot on.

I have cut and positioned sections ready for glueing but have am unsure of what adhesive and filler to choose. Can anyone advise me as there will certainly be at least small voids to be filled due to scars on the middle layer and my less than perfect scarf work.

Though I joined some years ago, I have been away from this site for some time due to the entirely worthy distraction of a grandchild.
However, at last I am now getting on with my boat in a garage in Corfe Castle.

Graham Wetten.

Graham,
Just patches to the deck?
If your working indoors and in reasonable temperatures then you have the options of epoxy like West or SP, which you can thicken with mircoballs to make your filler. Expensive and a bit messy to do, but superb glue. You wont need to buy a filler as well.
Other option is to use a PU adhesive like Balcotan, http://www.robbins.co.uk/Pdf%20Files/pl5_balcotan.pdf much easier to use, good at bonding gaps, (but not a filler) easier to use, less temperature and moisture sensitive, cheap but not as good a glue.

Choice is yours.

[Rupert]

Good to hear you found some mtching wood at Robbins - when I bought Agba from them a 7 or 8 years ago, it was much darker than the stuff used on the boats.

Hull repairs are very easy to do on a Firefly, but difficult to make pretty. The right colour wood is half the battle, though. As KFZ said, Epoxy is the best glue to use, as it will act as filler and glue in one. If you use sandings from the boat as a thickener, you may well get a reasonable colour match, too, though from my experience it will be a bit darker.

The closest glue to the original used is Cascophen, a nasty 2 part resin, black in colour. It is a room temp setting version of what was used in the ovens at Faireys. I used it 20 years ago to do a very large repair to a Albacore, and it certainly works, but is the messiest glue in the world. Would use epoxy now, thickened to fill in voids, but neat for the actual laying up.

Can you remember what they were calling the wood they sold you? If I could find a real matching wood, I'd re-do some of Saskia's patches.

[lindenlea]

Many thanks kfz and Rupert,

Your advice is much appreciated, particularly as this is my first project.

Sounds as though I was lucky with my colour of wood. I just walked into Robbins in Bristol and asked for some Agba veneer like I'd seen on the Pathe firefly clip, before they started charging to see it! Prior to cutting out the rotten sections, I rubbed the original varnish down to bare wood and it is this colour to which the new matches so well.

What happens when I varnish the whole remains to be seen but I am hopeful.

I refer to the pics of Vivette on the site for a steer and have already studied the Idiot's Guide to Varnishing which is so helpful.
The problem I seem to have is bending the repair sections to tight corners at the bow. My Wife's steam iron only gives limited flexibility but I haven't given up on steam yet.

Anyway, thanks again for your advice and this fascinating site.

Graham

[PeterV]

For the tight curves on my Fairey Finn I soaked the wood then clamped it in place. Once it was dry I cut the appropriate patch out of the corresponding part of the curve then glued and stapled it in as normal.

[lindenlea]

Dear Peter V,

Thank you for your tip re bending veneer. It worked a treat on the most difficult bit and I look forward to similar success on the rest.

Graham.

[Ed]

@rupert.

fwiw.....that 'darker' agba that Robbins had 7 or 8 years ago....

I was always firmly of the opinion that they had simply labelled it wrong....and it was khaya. The shelves were next door to each other and the Khaya one was always overloaded and the Agba one empty. But recently all the agba they have had has seemed like more or less the right colour.

cheers

eib

[Rupert]

Thanks Ed. I shall pop in there next time I am in Brizzle - if I can find them again!

[Mungo]

Kind of late into this... I think if the wood is similar the colours seem to blend in well with time, even after being finished.

My repairs were done with Agba that I gather was original from Fairey (Garry sent it to me). It was very light compared to what was on my boat. The repair when first done it was very obvious
http://i613.photobucket.com/albums/tt21 ... G_3310.jpg

after a year much less so http://i613.photobucket.com/albums/tt21 ... G_0067.jpg and now 2 years later it blends in very well colourwise. The workmanship is another story...

[nward]

Hi,
The Abga veneeer was 2mm thick and light golden in colour. We used cascamight glue (white) not the red which was used for the other wood work in the building. And from memory there were 5 layers in the hull.
Hope this is of help.
Nick

[Mr. Ben]

hi folks
2 more years have passed and I now have more hull repairs to do on the alby - the bailers are held in with rot and resin! So im on the scrounge for more off cuts of agba constructional veneer. happy to pay for anything you might have. I just cant justify buying a whole sheet!

thanks in advance.