Int Moth Hull - Free

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Jools
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Int Moth Hull - Free

Post by Jools » Sun Jul 04, 2010 6:55 pm

I have an Int Moth skiff hull from around 1971; rather Mistral like. It was in an awful state and was restored using good quality marine ply to a point where it should be usable for a season or two. Now red paint, varnished deck and interior. Stored inside since. Hull only with minimal fittings, dagger board, lifting rudder and a wing frame (but no tramps). No rig, sail, cover or trolley. Takes a standard period Needlespar rig. Located near Milton Keynes.
Skiff.JPG
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JB9
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Re: Int Moth Hull - Free

Post by JB9 » Sun Jul 04, 2010 7:16 pm

Have sent you a PM.
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davidh
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Re: Int Moth Hull - Free

Post by davidh » Sun Jul 04, 2010 7:47 pm

Hey jools - I had one just like that back in .......1975/76. Horribly unstable thing, though probably much easier than the 'low-riders' of today.

Jim C - you'll probably know the answer to this one - isn't this the boat that became the Europe?

D
David H

Rupert
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Re: Int Moth Hull - Free

Post by Rupert » Sun Jul 04, 2010 7:52 pm

The Europe was the Europa Moth, from 1960, from what I understand.
Rupert

davidh
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Re: Int Moth Hull - Free

Post by davidh » Sun Jul 04, 2010 8:02 pm

Rupert,

I had a sneaky feeling that the core design though was a mistral or early version - that Roland 'froze' in time to create the Europe!

a cracking boat for White friars!!!

D
David H

Jools
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Re: Int Moth Hull - Free

Post by Jools » Sun Jul 04, 2010 8:08 pm

Well it seems to have been snapped up after 20 mins, so one lucky person will find out how it goes. Sail number is 3140 as I recall, not mentioned in the on line year books available, so no idea what design it is. Something similar turned out one day at Bristol Avon SC in the 70's and in a light breeze put a lap on the Brit Moths, so it should be a light airs bandit, which is what I originally intended, hence not fitting the wings. The Europa was earlier in the 60's and became the Europe.

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Brookesy
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Re: Int Moth Hull - Free

Post by Brookesy » Mon Jul 05, 2010 11:23 am

The wings as mentioned are different but I'm pretty familiar with that hull shape as it looks like a late '60s Nervous Breakdown design, which although very tippy really flew in the light stuff and gave a good account for itself when it blew as well.
It was best to sail the angles downwind as I still have memories/nightmares of trying to sail dead down wind in mine.I seem to remember Chris Eyre won the Stokes Bay Courage Pursuit Race in his, now there was a race.
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jpa_wfsc
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Location: Oxford (Work) Coteswold Water Park (Sailing)

Re: Int Moth Hull - Free

Post by jpa_wfsc » Mon Jul 05, 2010 1:21 pm

'The Hopple' won't sail deep downwind (unless you like swimming on your back with a moth on top of you), a point or two up and its fast though! Probably most planing hulled moths would be the same?

(The Hopple is a Rondar 'Skol' GRP Moth from '72).
j./

National 12 "Spider" 2523
Finn K468 'Captain Scarlet'

British Moth, 630, early 60's 'Pisces'

!!!! Not CVRDA !!!!
Comet Trio - something always ready to sail.

davidh
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Re: Int Moth Hull - Free

Post by davidh » Mon Jul 05, 2010 1:36 pm

This isn't just a moth problem - I thikn the same could be sail for just about any of the una rigged single handers. The 'boat on top of you' however is evidence of another issue - when the leech falls away at the top of the sail, allowing the top batten to angle itself forward of the line of the boom.

Once these conditions start to exist then you are basically in pan and just waiting for everything to get wet and splashy. Actually, you can turn these circumstances into boat speed, let MORE boom out, heel the boat to weather and run by the lee. In any breeze or waves these can be tense moments - you feel the capsize is iminent but trust me, once the airflow across the sail is reversed - you will go quick.

Once the boat is planing - even on the dead run, then it is probably better to revert to the normal way of sailing - try more kicker (though not TOO much more) and keep the top batten in line with the boom!


Get the rig set up and then, as Paul Elvstrom would say, keep the hull under the rig!!

D
David H

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Ancient Geek
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Re: Int Moth Hull - Free

Post by Ancient Geek » Mon Jul 05, 2010 2:16 pm

And another way of putting it was as Peter Scott and Beecher Moore both told me, just pretend the mast is a broomstick and you are balancing it on your nose and steer to stay under it it's then instinctive.
Simples.

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jpa_wfsc
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Re: Int Moth Hull - Free

Post by jpa_wfsc » Mon Jul 05, 2010 3:30 pm

That all works on a Finn, OK, and even Phantom where you can get the boom out past say 75 deg. But on the Skol, the boom barely goes out more than 50 deg... AND the kicker is very weak (and yes it could be made stronger, but bits keep on falling of as it is!

I often sail The Hopple by the lee in less than hull speed winds, and in more than hull speed winds, Matt sails the moth and I sail the Finn!! :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

simples (as they say) and drier!! :mrgreen:
j./

National 12 "Spider" 2523
Finn K468 'Captain Scarlet'

British Moth, 630, early 60's 'Pisces'

!!!! Not CVRDA !!!!
Comet Trio - something always ready to sail.

davidh
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Re: Int Moth Hull - Free

Post by davidh » Mon Jul 05, 2010 4:01 pm

j,

your moth is no different to the contender - but the same rules apply there.

it does work though..... but can be a bit scary

D
David H

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Ancient Geek
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Re: Int Moth Hull - Free

Post by Ancient Geek » Mon Jul 05, 2010 4:28 pm

David H is correct a boat is a boat, Oppie to J Class and above. Twin hulls may be different as may asymetric skiffs who very seldom sail square down wind.
Simples.

iowlen
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Re: Int Moth Hull - Free

Post by iowlen » Mon Jul 05, 2010 11:11 pm

Moth's like this are still actively sailed & raced as Classic Moth's in the States.
McCutcheon Shelley's , Mistral's , Europa's & Europe's & Mistral variants , amongst many other older and newer designs.
Here are a few recent photo's ;
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davidh
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Re: Int Moth Hull - Free

Post by davidh » Tue Jul 06, 2010 7:51 am

Hmmm...some nice looking Banks Sails there. I was in their loft yesterday, although it is a lot smaller now than back in the heydays of Paul Nevard, Ken Ros, Dave Pitman and Bruce himself they are still busy....

But wonderful to see the classic moths all sailing, where was this? Are there other classic fleets in the US...14s maybe?

D
David H

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